在alien nation談alienation

上回寫到,近一年在香港工作的感覺比之前改善了,少了一些「邊緣人」的感覺。

原因很簡單,不過是因為多了跟其他創業者混而已。其中一班,每兩星期的周一會在cafe聚頭聊天,亦設了一個網站去分享關於創業的種種。其中一個帖,一群aliens居然談起alienation了。

Hiring Talented Developers in Hong Kong

Feb 04, 2010
chpapa said…


Actually I think a “sure path” is no longer possible for the younger generation in Hong Kong anymore, Well no one know what the opportunities are, but I think for us, the opportunity cost is really low and maybe making a rich startup community growing is the only opportunity we have to purse a enjoyable, fruitful, and less alienated life.

Feb 04, 2010
kin said…

less alienated life.. haha.

before we talk about how to pursue a less alienated life, however, maybe we should discuss how many of us actually think we are leading an alienated life?

i very much agree with you. i’ve no idea how many youngsters think that way though.

Feb 04, 2010
Jonathan Buford said…
Wow, interesting comments. I’ve been in and around HK for about 10 years now, and still learning about this sort of aspect of the culture. Actually, if you don’t mind, I would like to understand better what people think they are alienated from?

Feb 04, 2010
kin said…

i cant tell what people think but i may try to tell what i do .

i didn’t chat with ben offline on this , but i guess we are on the same page regarding alienation as defined by ckarl marx .

putting it to the current hk ‘s context, i think some people are alienated from their hobbies, their careers (jobs are something else ) and their dreams.

some youngsters , as per my subjective observation , become “mature ” by starting to believe they should give up their dreams for reality. this is where i suspect people themselves think it’s an alienation, or just maturity .

Feb 04, 2010
Gene Soo said…

“Giving up their dreams for reality” I get that feeling a lot from talking to people here. Perhaps it’s the high cost of living (e.g. real estate) in Hong Kong and pressure from family and peers, many people will choose to do something they dislike or are indifferent to in order to avoid “risk”.

Feb 04, 2010
Daniel Cheng said…

Thanks kin, confusion cleared.

Many youngsters here indeed blame “reality” for making them give up their dreams, but ironically most will be agape with embarrassment when asked “what are you dreaming about?” I think this is more of a, in my biased opinion, deeply-embedded mentality. Even for start-ups, I feel that more of them in the US are truly living their passions, instead of aiming for the “jackpot”.

But like Gene said, it’s good that more and more graduates start to shun the old rigid paths.

Feb 04, 2010
Jonathan Buford said…

I don’t think this kind of alienation is necessarily that unique to HK, at least in the respect that people get to a point where they feel that they need to grow up and do something different than they want to do if they will be successful.

I think the main difference is like Gene said, that friends and family (especially family) aren’t as supportive of pursuing those dreams. It seems like it is a bit of a vicious cycle, in that respect, that reinforces feelings of embarrassment or shame if you are doing something that doesn’t have a direct benefit for the family.

說我要求很低也好,說我要求很高也好,反正可以這樣聊天,我就滿足了。

或許我的靈魂仍然活在大學,坐在泳池邊、草地旁?

p.s. 同業朋友廣告一則:《戀愛嘉年華》

4 Replies to “在alien nation談alienation”

  1. “In emerging industrial production under capitalism, workers inevitably lose control of their lives and selves, in not having any control of their work. Workers never become autonomous, self-realized human beings in any significant sense, except the way the bourgeois want the worker to be realized ” — Marx’s observation of alienation

    1. While some say Marxist is proven to be wrong, i think the part that he’s right is important enough to be referenced in modern society, and to be a legend.

  2. More than that, Hong Kongers are facing very high tax without realizing it. Up rising property price and rent is a heavy tax on middle-class middle-aged citizens. Who dare to risk a “stable” job for dream ? Everyone is pressured by their mortgage payment.

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